Thanks Michael, good news – no violence

Well well well…

Interestingly enough, I got an email from my HS classmate who lives in Madison & is retired from teaching at a junior college.

As I am not sure of his political leanings, I asked him what I hoped would be neutral Qs, like was he personally affected.

And I was disappointed with his response. He was just leaving (Fri nite) for X-country skiing with his wife, was not personally affected & the other couple of sentences concerned younger acquaintances who in his words may have been “panicking” into thinking about early retirement.

No political involvement on his part (pro or con) anywhere in evidence. Sigh.

some people take the benefits without the work

YAY!

OT– “Britain freezes Gaddafi family assets as £900m of Libyan currency impounded” (guardian.co.uk, Sunday 27 February 2011 20.32 GMT) … “Emergency meeting of Privy Council held at Windsor Castle after Libyan leader reportedly moved £3bn to Britain”

“Berlusconi fraud court case resumes” (guardian.co.uk, Sunday 27 February 2011) … “Italian PM no longer immune from prosecution as sex life and business practices put under spotlight”

WTF???

He’s 67. Think he prolly worked for every penny he’s receiving.

I’m not disappointed with him bc he didn’t work for what he has, but bc, now that he’s retired & has more time he’s not more involved politically, esp on an issue as important as this.

But that’s imposing my values on him. And he has every right to his own values. Nothing whatsoever wrong with X-country skiing.

Capitol Police Chief’s calling plays on the spot, ignoring Walker.

Whoopie.

The best thing to do with a bully is to call his bluff.

eCAHNomics- Yes, maybe, but I come from a long line of never stopping… Howard Zinn worked for every penny
(and I know he’s smiling now)
nothing wrong with skiing but there is in not knowing the import of the moment

The Rule of Law also has a conscience. When the Law is perverted to a sufficient degree, those who will be on the receiving end of injustice (cops, for instance), just might think twice. Let’s hope they are.

From the Wisconsin State Journal:

Officials: No forcible removal of protesters from state Capitol

State officials said this evening there will be no forcible removal of protesters from the state Capitol.

“A decision has been made to do what they’ve been doing all week long and that is to do everything to keep things peaceful and keep people safe,” said Peg Schmidt, spokeswoman for the police command in the Capitol. “There’s not going to be any forcible removal.”

But officials would still like to clear the building so that it can be cleaned.

I think you’ll appreciate this photo (Madison, WI ; Feb. 26, 2011).

Thanks!

No tolerance on the left?

You’re welcome!

While we’re waiting for more info from Madison capitol, here’s one of the funnier headlines of the past couple of months. Not so much Huckleberry, but Christie??!!

Huckabee And Christie Defend First Lady’s Obesity Campaign Against Right-Wing Attacks

Link.

Huckabee’s sorry we don’t have more cannon fodder to feed the war machine. There is no way I want this guy anywhere near the ticket for POTUS (my take here).

I was referring to their ‘weighing’ in on obesity. Huckleberry, to his credit, has lost a lot of weight, and seems to be keeping it off. Christie, not so much.

As to their policies, a pox on both their houses.

However, our new gov in NYS (Cuomo, DINO) bears a remarkable resemblance to Christie (Rcrazy), which I pointed out to Cuomo in my first email to him. “What distinguishes you from any generic Republican?”

Tolerant but not indulgent; sorry, does that sound mean? I am more sensitive when I am looking a person in the face and these days of protests have made me sad and lonely for my parents who went to protests in walkers

Question for Michael.

As you are aware, PayPal is still denying contributions to Wikileak. Just this past week it blocked donations to Courage to Resist. The latter move was reversed in response to the FDL-organized petition.

With donations to Wikileaks stiil blocked, why would anyone wish to do business with PayPal? Isn’t it hypocritical to encourage folks to make contributions to the Bradley Manning fund using a company whose actions are intended to cripple Wikileaks?

Xipwire has been a reliable vehicle for enabling contributions to Wikileaks. I had contacted the sales group at Xipwire at the time of the PayPal cancellation. One of the people from Xipwire wrote back saying she had been in contact with Courage to Resist in the hope of working together with the organization, but CTR gave Xipwire no response.

In light of PayPal’s recent deplorable action, Courage to Resist should drop PayPal and partner with the reliable organization that is currently working with Wikileaks.

ghost

Thanks for your link earlier today. Found the entire program fascinating.

I have to wonder how much of this would have been avoided if Obama had not been elected president. Even if McSame was elected, he wouldn’t have had any real power and the 2012 election would have been in the Democrats favor. No flawed health care plan, maybe even a good one.

But would we be bombing Iran?

Fox Network to Walker. ‘Houston, we have a problem. No violence.’

I was just following orders.

I’m in a mood these days to remind people that others have agendas that do not coincide with ours and that we should respect everyones’ agendas whether we agree with them or not.

I think it is incumbent on us who share agendas (and your & mine prolly don’t coincide, as I am not much of an activist, though our views are prolly close) to find a way of convincing others why it is important that they do more to effectuate what we think.

So it is your job to convince me to get off my computer & go out & demonstrate, and my job to convince my HS classmate to spend a day demonstrating rather than X-country skiing. If that’s what we think the other should be doing with their time.

Rather than criticizing them for freely choosing how to spend their time & money instead of holding the sealed envelope to their forehead & magically choosing what we wish they would choose.

Recently (last weekend?) there was a book salon on global warming, where the host & author were unwaveringly critical of the doobs to not believe the scientific evidence. After going back & forth, & contributing my experience with how difficult it is to get anyone to think about the future, even though it may be upon us, I finally typed: Well, if climate change is about rising food prices, why not pump that meme, rather than the far more abstract meme that even most very smart peeps won’t understand, which is that climate is changing & that is bad.

IOW, figure out a way to convince your audience to take up your POV.

For the moment, 35 minutes after the supposed clearing of the Capitol Building, the police have no orders to move people

Based on Dayen’s tweet, the assertion that “the police have no orders to move people” seems like an assumption more than a fact.

From what I recall of the Madison police chief’s reaction to Walker’s efforts to disrupt peaceful protests, I wouldn’t be surprised if Walker ordered the police to remove the protesters and the police just folded their arms.

I don’t think McSame would bomb Iran if Bush didn’t.

While awaiting Michael’s response, wondering if the treatening posture by Walker is intended to provoke an angry response which could then be played up to denigrate the union supporters. In the punk call Walker has already admitted to consider dirty tricks. Read in one of DDay’s earlier posts that in the Rotunda, teach-ins about non-violence were being offered. That’s confirmation for me that the folks in Madison are on the ball.

To give a bit of historical perspective, Madison was one of the focal points of the anti-Vietnam War movement in the late ’60s. An incident on UW campus in 1970, just weeks after the Kent State shootings, took the wind out out the anti-war movement nationwide.

Just saying.

See #29.

This Op-ed was on Google for about two seconds. It’s good:
U.S. Recovery Might Need Public-Sector Unions: Tom Juravich
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2011-02-27/u-s-recovery-might-need-public-sector-unions-tom-juravich.html

(Can’t get the links thingy to work)

We agree- remember I wasn’t speaking to him…it wasn’t personal but you were disappointed.
I’m 63, unemployed now but have worked for non-profits most of my life or taken care of my parents here at the end. I spent a lot of time at the 3 protests we have gone to here in Ohio trying to bridge the gap between people and recalling history with them. I am overjoyed to seen the vast change in protest culture over the years. The everyman photographs, for example. But for every thousand in a rally there are 10 thousand who agree but won’t show it. Perhaps the ballot box was once an effective representation coffer for an individual’s belief system- but no more.
I bring out my Dr Seus Barthlomew books to read. I want everyone to be a Horton. What a wonderful world that would be.
But on another issue: money; I don’t agree there is too much money being used out of the context of morality and yes, simple commonsense. Many people spend money without a point of view.

Live video from the Rotunda.

Dipshit Wanker just put stick in the hornet’s nest — he’s awakened the youth, and they ain’t voting Republican.

I think there was a reason the police stayed over night on Saturday and will tonight.

Have a friend in Madison who was in the capitol who has a friend still inside. He says a number of off duty police officers are inside out of uniform with the protesters risking their jobs.

Bravo Madison police. They’re there to keep a lookout for Wanker’s thugs, since the dipshit already telegraphed his thinking.

Yes, I was disappointed.

But haven’t figured out yet how to tell him that without judging his personal decisions, which I take as sacrosanct (since I have no evidence that he is a psychopath and some history suggesting the contrary).

Thanks for that. That may signal a the beginning of a flood of similar reports to follow.

The rich-tard cabal is going down. Someone needs to volunteer to be the referee to blow the whistle when it’s time to stop the piling on.

The only way I can figure out the rich going down is when they run out of customers.

I thought that might be now.

The history is:

1. Real wages don’t rise, so more members/hh go out to work.

2. Low unemployment during Clinton admin briefly allows for rising wages & rising consumer spending.

3. Rising home prices during 00s allow for increasing debt levels & rising consumer spending.

4.???

Thought it would have come to an end by now, but apparently not.

I expected the path you describe and have tried to understand what’s happening. Is it possible the fed can create money for a while to keep assets inflated?

You may not be able to find a way because the situation will have to comfortably arise. You have already given him an impression: as non-neutral as your questions were, he must have understood that you cared and may have even sensed that you hoped/expected he was more in the know than he was. You left a seed.
We don’t know each other, but I am sure neither you or I would have been accusatory or belittling toward him.

yes

Yes. Asset price inflation is integral. But so few real peeps benefit from it anymore, it’s hard to understand how any widespread consumer spending increase can occur.

Every once in a while, police officers surprise me (in a good way). The Madison police officers are doing the right thing. Everyone seems to understand that except Walker, the assholes above Walker pulling his strings, and the sycophants and ignoramuses around Walker and others like him.

My guess is that consumer spending is increasing in places like India and Korea while it’s decreasing here.

4. Collapse of credit card industry, like that of banking industry under weight of consumers not able to service high-interest-rate debt.

Where is the money for the economic growth we are seeing coming from? Not business investment, not government spending to speak of (and that is declining sharply if the GOP gets its way), and definitely not from the balance of trade. So it has to be coming from consumers. But which consumers?

Well…

I did tell him I was glad that he was not personally affected, that I wasn’t so sure the “panic” he described among his younger acquaintances was misplaced, given what Walker was doing, and that I was sorry that I lived long enough to see what govts in U.S. were doing.

So, planted seeds to be sure.

ECAHN can correct me, but I don’t think consumer spending is going down in the U.S. Unemployment is high and staying there. Wages are stagnant at best. And the savings rate seems to have increased. I don’t understand.

No, it’s increasing in the U.S.

Too late & I’m too tired to engage in the details, but will give it one go.

The U.S. household savings rate increased enough during the downturn to provide a bit of fuel for increased borrowing. Also, just enough increase in employment to allow for increased spending. So U.S. consumers, who, even if they don’t benefit directly from asset price (stock prices, not oil or food) inflation, take it as a signal that times will get better. And thus increase their spending. And thus the economy improves.

You have to monitor that cycle closely to be on top of what will happen over the next half-year or more, but it seems for now that there is enough momentum to keep the U.S. economy on an uptrend for now.

Answered immediately below yours, in my 49.

I would add only that it is a lot more difficult to get U.S. consumers to stop spending than it is to get them to spend.

So it is an asymmetric relationship. And pessimists about the near term for the U.S. economy should take note.

I’m not being judgmental. Just trying to pass along the hard-learned lessons of my many years as a U.S. econ forecaster.

Great link.

Thanks.

Thanks very much. I think I understand. Your response at 49 came in while I was writing. I wouldn’t have pestered you.

Have a good evening.

Not pestering at all.

Thanks to you and frmrirprsn for correcting and clarifying.

If consumers take any cues from what happens on Wall Street, this last week suggests that there may be some bumps. There has to be correction ahead.

Consumers typically not that responsive to near term stock market corrections. Here’s a chart of a survey that I’ve found useful. You can judge for yourself that the ups & downs are frequent & a trend must be established before you can be definitive. (Keynes is reported to have said, when the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do?)

I have found the same thing wrt to consumers’ opinions about the U.S. economy. With the asymetry I have already referred to. So it also takes a lot bigger decline in consumer sentiment before consumer spending backs off than the reverse.

A very good outcome. Walker wanted the protesters out of the Capitol tonight, but to paraphrase someone who shall remain unnamed, “how many divisions does the Governor have?”.
I was watching the live stream for about 2 hrs from 4-6 pm, and you could tell from the cops’ body language that they really did NOT want to start forcing people out. Plus you could see they were totally undermanned compared to the # of protesters. By the time they walked or carried them all out, it would have been time to reopen the building in the morning.

Great find, Kassandra, and in a business publication, no less!

Walker might be facing a crisis of legitimacy. He can order the state capitol cleared, but who has to do the work? Public employees.

He can order layoffs, but who has to issue the pink slips and make the changes in the accounting programs to cut off pay? Public employees.

He might have the commander of the State Patrol in his pocket, but will the State Patrol obey?

Dictatorial leaders often forget that people really are not obligated to snap-to when they order something. It must be in their interest for reasons of fear, greed, or pride. What happens when public employees massively lose their fear of a tyrant with a rigged legislature?

Holding the people’s space (“Whose house? Our house.) is critical to the defeat of Walker’s plan and a necessary but not sufficient step to securing his resignation. What has to happen to move in that direction is to get the support of the general public in Wisconsin — not some opinion poll support, but real support that gets the Republicans to back down and causes them to see Walker as out of his depth and taking the party down with him.

Teddy Partridge is upstairs!
Sunday Late Night: Newt’s 1999 Divorce Lawyer Now Speaks for His Campaign

Citizen TarheelDem:

Indeed, keepin’ the capitol open just sealed Governor Shitforbrains’ fate and that of his political party in this state goin’ forward. As of right now, Russ Feingold seems to hold the immediate future of politics in this state if he can take advantage and let the people move this thing from moment to moment.

!De Nada!

I took that to mean that some people take all of the benefits resulting from protests without engaging in any protesting themselves.

Imagine if your government actually represented you.­..

1. National Infrastruc­­­ture Bank – Run by engineers, not politician­­­s. Federal government invest $2 trillion over 10 years to create jobs now and increase productivi­­­ty later. Put millions back to work. Fund with millionair­­­e’s tax

2. Federal government invest 6% of GDP yearly on R & D to create quality jobs long term in areas like biotechnol­­­ogy, alternativ­­­e energy, alternativ­­­e-fuel automobile­­­s, clean technology­­­, etc. Fund with 7% national sales (innovatio­n) tax

3. Stop killing people in our name and reduce the bloated defense budget

4. Permanently end Bush tax cuts

5. Reform Health Care – target costs at 10% (currently 17%) of GDP with Medicare for all

6. Reform Tax Code – Enact The Bipartisan Tax Fairness and Simplifica­­­tion Act of 2010 – Eliminate up to $1 trillion in tax credits and change the top individual income tax bracket to 50% to balance the budget

7. Reform Wall St. – Break up the big banks and strengthen the Volker Rule

8. Reform Education – Raise educationa­­­l standards through a national core curriculum­­­. Fire the bottom 10% of teachers nationwide and replace them with good teachers. Make higher education free to families that can’t afford it to encourage upward mobility. Fund with financial transactio­­­ns and bank tax

9. Reform Social Security – Raise the ceiling on income subject to the Social Security tax to $180,000 to restore solvency to the program

10. Reform Federal Elections – Enact the Fair Elections Now Act. Strictly voluntary. Matching funds. $100.00 maximum donation

11. Foreclosure Legislation – give bankruptcy judges the power to order reductions in mortgage principal owed. Use leverage on banks rescued by government to insist on deep refinancings.

another great night in Wisconsin to relish and remember for the struggle ahead

a joke cribbed from an anonymous commenter on http://lippmannsghost.blogspot.com/2011/02/union-busting-and-koch-brothers-plans.html

A union citizen worker, a teabagger/uninformed citizen and a CEO are sitting at a table. There is a plate of a dozen cookies between them. The CEO reaches over and takes 11 cookies then looks at the uninformed teabagger and says: “Watch out that other guy wants a piece of your cookie.”